Some Practice

Ph8
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Some Practice

Anyone who feels like having a good laugh watch this

http://whygodexists.ytmnd.com

and then tear apart their argument.

Have fun.


Bryan T
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I hate it when people argue

I hate it when people argue and bullshit things to make them fit there description.

One major flaw with that is it proves that god had to be created meaning he is the not supreme being.


Voided
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Yeah, but they will just

Yeah, but they will just say, "well god is outside of everything so he doesn't need a cause" in other words magic...


blood pig
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I didn't even watch that

I didn't even watch that whole thing. All it did was piss me off lol


Greg
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they think that, since

they think that, since according to them, we pretty much will not understand the power and will of god. Which in a way gives them a twisted superiority complex that you just want to beat into the ground.


keasbynights241
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The First Cause argument is

The First Cause argument is a terrible argument for God.. Much like all other arguments for Him, but that one is my least favorite.

But it is a really good question to ask how all of this came to be..


AgnosticAtheist1
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Imaginary time

Richard Dawkins put forth a VERY interesting argument on the validity of the Big Bang Theory in respect to imaginary time. If you google 'chapter 8' 'Richard Dawkins' 'Imaginary Time' it will probably come up. There's one quote in it where Dawkins denounces an old theory, and Christians always use that quote to say how even scientists say Big Bang makes no sense. They leave out the next part, wher ehe says he supports a different theory, and goes on to say why.

-There is no sin save faith


GrapeScentedGuru
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They never really address

They never really address the probability that perhaps the universe is outside of physics and conception. I mean, it's a constantly expanding volume with a constant mass, yet there's no change in density. Sounds pretty contradictive to me. And for it to be expanding, that'd mean there'd have to be a limit to it. And so, what it 'outside' that limit?


keasbynights241
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I think about that

[quote=GrapeScentedGuru]They never really address the probability that perhaps the universe is outside of physics and conception. I mean, it's a constantly expanding volume with a constant mass, yet there's no change in density. Sounds pretty contradictive to me. And for it to be expanding, that'd mean there'd have to be a limit to it. And so, what it 'outside' that limit?[/quote]

I think about that all the time...


GrapeScentedGuru
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Infinite possibility creates

Infinite possibility creates infinite probability of infinite insanity.

I said that one day back when I used to get stoned.


Derevirn
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If everything needs a cause

If everything needs a cause why doesn't God need one?
if God doesn't need a cause why does the universe need one?

I'm tired of stating the obvious... besides that, aren't they supposed to have faith? why are they bothered with (pseudo-)logic?


blood pig
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feafa

[quote=GrapeScentedGuru]Infinite possibility creates infinite probability of infinite insanity.

I said that one day back when I used to get stoned.[/quote]
I'm going to have to remember that lol.

I too always think of what lays beyond what we know.
It bugs me..but There's really not shit i can do about it is there lol


GWG
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God

For you to understand where God came from you have to step out of science or the physical & into the spiritual.

God is not a physical being. He has no physical flesh. Therefore why would He need to be created or made?

Until He created the earth there was no such thing as time. He created it (time) for us so we could live with order & purpose. Our free will requires order just as it requires answers to questions which it cannot, or will not, understand. That is why some people ask Christians to prove God to them.

If I could prove God I, being physical, would have to become spiritual. Can I do that? Not unless I was God. That is why Christians cannot provide what you call "ample scientific evidence" for the existence of God because such a physical being does not exist.

God is not a test tube God that you can poke & prod at or touch & feel or even see & hear. He is more powerful than that. As a spiritual being He is not held down by the laws that govern us. He is not affected by gravity, He cannot suffocate without oxygen, and He cannot even be burned by fire.

Not only does this explain why we cannot show you where God is but it also explains how he performs miracles which you call magic or illusions.

On the other hand, a spiritual God is all-existent. Everything is about him. Could this not be possible? If you really think about this you might begin to wonder.

Would a physical being (us) be able to see with physical eyes that which is spiritual (God)?

It's kind of like the Invisible Man. Since the man had no physical properties the physical eye could not see him. That is how it is with God. He is not made of physical properties; he is a spiritual being, he exists in a realm we cannot reach while on earth.

I know this post should be in the fourm on God but I had to at least try & say something to answer your question.

Praise God,
GWG


Noor
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Any proof for your spiritual

Any proof for your spiritual realm?


GWG
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Proof of the Spiritual

Do you have any proof for love or freedom? both are ideas, yet we know that they exist. Now, they are only things in man's mind but they still can't be seen. We just see the effects.

Our evidences of the spiritual realm are these: There are oceans that seperate nation from nation & yet even though there is hardly any communication between the U.S & say the deep jungles of Africa the people there still claim the same impact of God upon their hearts as we do.

The only way we gain proof of the supernatural is when it manifests itself.

Now, our other proof is in the medical realm. I could relay countless stories to you of how people were saved from something deadly or paralyzing after someone either prayed for them, they prayed themselves, or they were saved. There are so many accounts & their stories are so long that it would take a whole page to demonstrate what I mean. But, if you want me to send you them just e-mail me & I will send you a quick compilation of the most incredible tales. My e-mail address is [b][email protected][/b]

If you start to claim that all these things are "coincidence" or they are "easily explainable" I will give you the whole list & then let you say they were "coincidental"

This is our proof.

I would bring up Jesus & all the events that transpired in his life from the point of his conception to his resurrection but I know that that is a discussion for another forum.

Praise God,
GWG


HeliosOfTheSun
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Quote:Now, our other proof

[quote]Now, our other proof is in the medical realm. I could relay countless stories to you of how people were saved from something deadly or paralyzing after someone either prayed for them, they prayed themselves, or they were saved. There are so many accounts & their stories are so long that it would take a whole page to demonstrate what I mean. But, if you want me to send you them just e-mail me & I will send you a quick compilation of the most incredible tales.[/quote]

I remember a RRS eposide where they where talking about when they took 10 sick people and prayed on 5 of them. The ones that wherent prayed on came out better. Prayer cant be used as proof. Why you ask? Evere heard of:

State the problem
Gather information
Hypotheis
Experiment
Record data
Gather information
Conclusion

Now, can you some how put prayer on a scale like that? If Im sick I rather take a medical drug then watch a man with robes dance like a wild-man around my body throwing water on me, but hey thats me.

[quote]There are oceans that seperate nation from nation & yet even though there is hardly any communication between the U.S & say the deep jungles of Africa the people there still claim the same impact of God upon their hearts as we do.[/quote]

Sorry to inform you but people who live in the African jungles dont believe in your God. In matter fact the only Christian nations in Africa are South Africa etc. North of the Shara is Islamic, your enemies.

[quote]If you start to claim that all these things are "coincidence" or they are "easily explainable" I will give you the whole list & then let you say they were "coincidental" [/quote]

I can too, I call it Evoultion, Fossils, Carbon-dating, Astromoty, Chemistry, Biology, and DNA.


GWG
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RRS Episode on Prayer/Africans/Faith vs. Temptation

Well, your first comment is very unstable.

First off, why was this episode filmed? Was it because the patients & the people praying were truly seeking God or were they doing so to test him? The Bible says that no man can test God. That means those people. I don't know but I'll assume God didn't let those 5 who were prayed over get better because they were trying to test God.

If you've studied the Bible you would realize that God only acts where true faith is. If you had told me of this episode a few weeks before they started videoing I could have foreseen these events. He says if you don't believe, you won't recieve.
This is what Jesus (no I don't want to debate here on whether he existed or was the Son of God) said to Satan who was trying to tempt him :
[b]Mat 4:7[/b] Jesus said unto him, [quote]It is written again, Thou shalt not tempt the Lord thy God[/quote].

Who are we to demand God to come & do what we want? Especially if, like you, I don''t believe he exists. Should he be afraid of you not believeing? We as human beings are unimportant to him except for his love of us as His Creation.

As I said you must step out of science & tests & into theology & the spiritual realm.

As I stated in my last post I will e-mail you the stories & then let you tell me what you think.

Also, I don't know the denomination of the people praying & though I don't judge according to denomination there are some false churches out there. If the man prayed as you siad he did - with water, a dance & the robe - then I know he was false for no where was that practiced in the Bible except in superstition & witchcraft.

Next, I never said all of the people in those jungles because if it was so churches wouldnt need to be sending missionaries into the jungle. But I promise you that all of the natives are not Islamic as you have said.

There are still many that have never even been reached.

When I refer to these Africans I mean those who have been saved.

Again, all you have to do is e-mail me & I will give you the list of stories on miracles as well as a few on africans & other types of people who were turned from witchcraft or whatever their religion was even though it had a tight grip on them.

Finally, if you want to debate Evolution please go over to the Creation vs. Evolution forum & post there. I'm trying to do the Admin a favor by keeping this forum clear of anything that does not correspond with the topic or with the topic's train of debate.

Again, post in the other forum & I will debate you on this topic.

Did my responses answer your reply (or questions)?

Praise God,
GWG


HeliosOfTheSun
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Quote:Also, I don't know the

[quote]Also, I don't know the denomination of the people praying & though I don't judge according to denomination there are some false churches out there. If the man prayed as you siad he did - with water, a dance & the robe [/quote]

Last time I checked preist walk around sick people throwing water on faces and talk out of the Bible, yet it does nothing.

[quote]As I said you must step out of science & tests & into theology & the spiritual realm. [/quote]

You mean from fact and truth to unreal and imaginary?


GWG
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Priest/Science

By priests I assume you mean Catholic? I will not say anything against all Catholics because some are still obeying God but many of the Catholics of today have stayed completely away from the Bible & only use it to appeal to those who are Catholic.

Also, your RRS people are, of course, trying to prove prayer doesn't work in this episode so they picked the craziest looking, most illogical, unbiblical priest they could find so that you as the viewer assume we are all like that. This is one of the oldest tricks in advertising, marketing & brainwashing. They make you think what you like or are is something old fashioned, silly, simple minded, or just plain stupid. Its called misdirection by magicians & overexaggerated criticism in advertising.

Next, I am not saying step out of truth, reality & science as in disregarding the five senses I am saying step out as in quit trying to study what science does not deal with by it's methods. Science is the one of the most important things people should study when it stays within it's boundaries. But, in this case, the spiritual world cannot be felt, smelt, seen, tasted or heard. This situation is not the only case where Science has boundaries.

People, including yourself, claim that evolution is science. Actually, that is incorrect. If Evolution was the observance & testing of objects that are here now it would be Science. But it is not.

Evolution is actually history. Think about it. Science deals with the five senses. So, can you taste the big bang or the evolution in an amoeba? Can you taste meat from a dinosaur? Of course not so scratch the tongue off your list. Can you feel an amoeba mutating or feel a caveman's skin? Nope, scratch the hands off. Now, can you observe an amoeba mutating? Maybe you can observe other objects changing through microevolution & such but can you observe a mutation in a monkey? No, so again, scratch eyes. Can you smell a dinosaur or smell an acid in the atmosphere that was required to start life? Nope, again, scratch. We come down to the final sense, the ears. Can you hear a dinosaur roar? Can you hear a caveman start to talk? NOOOOO! So how can Evolution, at least, the beginning of the universe, the beginning of life, the evolution in creatures & the evolution of man be Science? It is all historical events because it happened in the past & we cannot test the past. Science is the observance & testing of present events. That is why those sections of Evolution cannot be Science. And if they are not, what else is left?

I hope I have answered you post.

Praise God,
GWG


P-Dunn
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Bryan T wrote:One major flaw

[quote=Bryan T]One major flaw with that is it proves that god had to be created meaning he is the not supreme being.[/quote]
How does it prove such a thing? The argument is not, "Everything has a cause," but "Whatever began to exist has a cause."


HeliosOfTheSun
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Quote:Also, your RRS people

[quote]Also, your RRS people are, of course, trying to prove prayer doesn't work in this episode so they picked the craziest looking, most illogical, unbiblical priest they could find so that you as the viewer assume we are all like that. This is one of the oldest tricks in advertising, marketing & brainwashing. They make you think what you like or are is something old fashioned, silly, simple minded, or just plain stupid. Its called misdirection by magicians & overexaggerated criticism in advertising.[/quote]

I never said RRS put preist in prayer, I said I wouldnt want to be prayed on by one.

[quote]Science deals with the five senses.[/quote]
Then that would make atoms not part I science right?
Can you see atoms?
Can you taste atoms?
Can you hear atoms?
Can you feel atoms?
Can you smell atoms?
The only one close to yes would be see and thats if you use electron microscopes.


GWG
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In response to your first

In response to your first point, yees maybe you were but it came from us talking about the RRS episode. What I said is still true.

Second of all, you can see an atom alive (or at least moving) yes only through a microscope but, as I said before, Science is one of the most important pursuits in this life, at least, in education. When did I bar the use of Scientific equipment?

Praise God,
GWG


GWG
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In response to your first

In response to your first point, yes maybe you were but it came from us talking about the RRS episode. What I said is still true.

Second of all, you can see an atom alive (or at least moving) yes only through a microscope but, as I said before, Science is one of the most important pursuits in this life, at least, in education. When did I bar the use of Scientific equipment?

Praise God,
GWG


GWG
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Hey blood pig &

Hey P-Dunn, blood pig & noor,

Whenever you get a chance go to the announcements section & check out the forum called Juror Debate Rules. While there think about whether or not you would want to take part in a debate between four atheists, agnostics etc. & four Christians. It gives a better explanation in there.

Praise God,
GWG