Contridictions in the Bible
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War or Peace?
EXO 15:3 The LORD is a man of war: the LORD is his name.
ROM 15:33 Now the God of peace be with you all. Amen.
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Who is the father of Joseph?
MAT 1:16 And Jacob begat Joseph the husband of Mary, of whom was born Jesus, who is called Christ.
LUK 3:23 And Jesus himself began to be about thirty years of age, being (as was supposed) the son of Joseph, which was the son of Heli.
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Who was at the Empty Tomb? Is it:
MAT 28:1 In the end of the sabbath, as it began to dawn toward the first day of the week, came Mary Magdalene and the other Mary to see the sepulchre.
MAR 16:1 And when the sabbath was past, Mary Magdalene, and Mary the mother of James, and Salome, had bought sweet spices, that they might come and anoint him.
JOH 20:1 The first day of the week cometh Mary Magdalene early, when it was yet dark, unto the sepulchre, and seeth the stone taken away from the sepulchre.
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Is Jesus equal to or lesser than?
JOH 10:30 I and my Father are one.
JOH 14:28 Ye have heard how I said unto you, I go away, and come again unto you. If ye loved me, ye would rejoice, because I said, I go unto the Father: for my Father is greater than I.
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Which first--beasts or man?
GEN 1:25 And God made the beast of the earth after his kind, and cattle after their kind, and every thing that creepeth upon the earth after his kind: and God saw that it was good.
GEN 1:26 And God said, Let us make man in our image, after our likeness: and let them have dominion over the fish of the sea, and over the fowl of the air, and over the cattle, and over all the earth, and over every creeping thing that creepeth upon the earth.
GEN 2:18 And the LORD God said, It is not good that the man should be alone; I will make him an help meet for him.
GEN 2:19 And out of the ground the LORD God formed every beast of the field, and every fowl of the air; and brought them unto Adam to see what he would call them: and whatsoever Adam called every living creature, that was the name thereof.
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The number of beasts in the ark
GEN 7:2 Of every clean beast thou shalt take to thee by sevens, the male and his female: and of beasts that are not clean by two, the male and his female.
GEN 7:8 Of clean beasts, and of beasts that are not clean, and of fowls, and of every thing that creepeth upon the earth, GEN 7:9 There went in two and two unto Noah into the ark, the male and the female, as God had commanded Noah.
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How many stalls and horsemen?
KI1 4:26 And Solomon had forty thousand stalls of horses for his chariots, and twelve thousand horsemen.
CH2 9:25 And Solomon had four thousand stalls for horses and chariots, and twelve thousand horsemen; whom he bestowed in the chariot cities, and with the king at Jerusalem.
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Is it folly to be wise or not?
PRO 4:7 Wisdom is the principal thing; therefore get wisdom: and with all thy getting get understanding.
ECC 1:18 For in much wisdom is much grief: and he that increaseth knowledge increaseth sorrow.
1 Cor.1:19: "For it is written, I will destroy the wisdom of the wise, and wil bring to nothing the understanding of the prudent."
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Human vs. ghostly impregnation
ACT 2:30 Therefore being a prophet, and knowing that God had sworn with an oath to him, that of the fruit of his loins, according to the flesh, he would raise up Christ to sit on his throne;
MAT 1:18 Now the birth of Jesus Christ was on this wise: When as his mother Mary was espoused to Joseph, before they came together, she was found with child of the Holy Ghost.
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The sins of the father
ISA 14:21 Prepare slaughter for his children for the iniquity of their fathers; that they do not rise, nor possess the land, nor fill the face of the world with cities.
DEU 24:16 The fathers shall not be put to death for the children, neither shall the children be put to death for the fathers: every man shall be put to death for his own sin.
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The bat is not a bird
LEV 11:13 And these are they which ye shall have in abomination among the fowls; they shall not be eaten, they are an abomination: the eagle, and the ossifrage, and the ospray,
LEV 11:14 And the vulture, and the kite after his kind;
LEV 11:15 Every raven after his kind;
LEV 11:16 And the owl, and the night hawk, and the cuckow, and the hawk after his kind,
LEV 11:17 And the little owl, and the cormorant, and the great owl,
LEV 11:18 And the swan, and the pelican, and the gier eagle,
LEV 11:19 And the stork, the heron after her kind, and the lapwing, and the bat.
DEU 14:11 Of all clean birds ye shall eat.
DEU 14:12 But these are they of which ye shall not eat: the eagle, and the ossifrage, and the ospray,
DEU 14:13 And the glede, and the kite, and the vulture after his kind,
DEU 14:14 And every raven after his kind,
DEU 14:15 And the owl, and the night hawk, and the cuckow, and the hawk after his kind,
DEU 14:16 The little owl, and the great owl, and the swan,
DEU 14:17 And the pelican, and the gier eagle, and the cormorant,
DEU 14:18 And the stork, and the heron after her kind, and the lapwing, and the bat.
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Rabbits do not chew their cud
LEV 11:6 And the hare, because he cheweth the cud, but divideth not the hoof; he is unclean unto you.
'Gerah', the term which appears in the MT means (chewed) cud, and also perhaps grain, or berry (also a 20th of a sheckel, but I think that we can agree that that is irrelevant here). It does *not* mean dung, and there is a perfectly adequate Hebrew word for that, which could have been used. Furthermore, the phrase translated 'chew the cud' in the KJV is more exactly 'bring up the cud'. Rabbits do not bring up anything; they let it go all the way through, then eat it again. The description given in Leviticus is inaccurate, and that's that. Rabbits do eat their own dung; they do not bring anything up and chew on it.
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Insects do NOT have four feet
LEV 11:21 Yet these may ye eat of every flying creeping thing that goeth upon all four, which have legs above their feet, to leap withal upon the earth;
LEV 11:22 Even these of them ye may eat; the locust after his kind, and the bald locust after his kind, and the beetle after his kind, and the grasshopper after his kind.
LEV 11:23 But all other flying creeping things, which have four feet, shall be an abomination unto you.
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Snails do not melt
PSA 58:8 As a snail which melteth, let every one of them pass away: like the untimely birth of a woman, that they may not see the sun.
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Fowl from waters or ground?
GEN 1:20 And God said, Let the waters bring forth abundantly the moving creature that hath life, and fowl that may fly above the earth in the open firmament of heaven.
GEN 1:21 And God created great whales, and every living creature that moveth, which the waters brought forth abundantly, after their kind, and every winged fowl after his kind: and God saw that it was good.
GEN 2:19 And out of the ground the LORD God formed every beast of the field, and every fowl of the air; and brought them unto Adam to see what he would call them: and whatsoever Adam called every living creature, that was the name thereof.
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Odd genetic engineering
GEN 30:39 And the flocks conceived before the rods, and brought forth cattle ringstraked, speckled, and spotted.
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The shape of the earth
ISA 40:22 It is he that sitteth upon the circle of the earth, and the inhabitants thereof are as grasshoppers; that stretcheth out the heavens as a curtain, and spreadeth them out as a tent to dwell in:
MAT 4:8 Again, the devil taketh him up into an exceeding high mountain, and sheweth him all the kingdoms of the world, and the glory of them;
Astromical bodies are spherical, and you cannot see the entire exterior surface from anyplace. The kingdoms of Egypt, China, Greece, Crete, sections of Asia Minor, India, Maya (in Mexico), Carthage (North Africa), Rome (Italy), Korea, and other settlements from these kingdoms of the world were widely distributed.
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Snakes, while built low, do not eat dirt
GEN 3:14 And the LORD God said unto the serpent, Because thou hast done this, thou art cursed above all cattle, and above every beast of the field; upon thy belly shalt thou go, and dust shalt thou eat all the days of thy life:
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Earth supported?
JOB 26:7 He stretcheth out the north over the empty place, and hangeth the earth upon nothing.
JOB 38:4 Where wast thou when I laid the foundations of the earth? declare, if thou hast understanding.
Heaven supported too
JOB 26:11 The pillars of heaven tremble and are astonished at his reproof.
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The hydrological cycle
ECC 1:7 All the rivers run into the sea; yet the sea is not full; unto the place from whence the rivers come, thither they return again.
JOB 38:22 Hast thou entered into the treasures of the snow? or hast thou seen the treasures of the hail,
Storehouses are not part of the cycle
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Order of creation
Here is the order in the first (Genesis 1), the Priestly tradition:
Day 1: Sky, Earth, light
Day 2: Water, both in ocean basins and above the sky(!)
Day 3: Plants
Day 4: Sun, Moon, stars (as calendrical and navigational aids)
Day 5: Sea monsters (whales), fish, birds, land animals, creepy-crawlies (reptiles, insects, etc.)
Day 6: Humans (apparently both sexes at the same time)
Day 7: Nothing (the Gods took the first day off anyone ever did)
Note that there are "days," "evenings," and "mornings" before the Sun was created. Here, the Deity is referred to as "Elohim," which is a plural, thus the literal translation, "the Gods." In this tale, the Gods seem satisfied with what they have done, saying after each step that "it was good."
The second one (Genesis 2), the Yahwist tradition, goes:
Earth and heavens (misty)
Adam, the first man (on a desolate Earth)
Plants
Animals
Eve, the first woman (from Adam's rib)
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How orderly were things created?
#1: Step-by-step. The only discrepancy is that there is no Sun or Moon or stars on the first three "days."
#2: God fixes things up as he goes. The first man is lonely, and is not satisfied with animals. God finally creates a woman for him. (funny thing that an omniscient god would forget things)
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How satisfied with creation was he?
#1: God says "it was good" after each of his labors, and rests on the seventh day, evidently very satisfied.
#2: God has to fix up his creation as he goes, and he would certainly not be very satisfied with the disobedience of that primordial couple. (funny thing that an omniscient god would forget things)
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Moses' personality
Num.12:3: "Now the man Moses was very meek, above all the men which were upon the fact of the earth."
Num.31:14, 17, 18: "And Moses was wroth...And Moses said unto them, "Have ye saved all the women alive? ... Now therefore kill every male among the little ones, and kill every woman, ... But all the women children ... keep alive for yourselves."
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Righteous live?
Ps.92:12: "The righteous shall flourish like the palm tree."
Isa.57:1: "The righteous perisheth, and no man layeth it to heart."
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Acts 1:18: "Now this man (Judas) purchased a field with the reward of iniquity; and falling headlong, he burst asunder in the midst, and all his bowels gushed out."
Matt. 27:5-7: "And he (Judas) cast down the pieces of silver in the temple, and departed, and went and hanged himself. And the chief priests...bought with them the potter's field."
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Jesus' first sermon plain or mount?
Matt.5:1,2: "And seeing the multitudes, he went up into a mountain: and when he was set, his disciples came unto him: And he opened his mouth, and taught them, saying...."
Luke6:17,20: "And he came down with them, and stood in the plain, and the company of his disciples, and a great multitude of people...came to hear him.. And he lifted up his eyes on his disciples and said..."
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Jesus' last words
Matt.27:46,50: "And about the ninth hour Jesus cried with a loud voice, saying, "Eli, eli, lama sabachthani?" that is to say, "My God, my God, why hast thou forsaken me?" ...Jesus, when he cried again with a loud voice, yielded up the ghost."
Luke23:46: "And when Jesus had cried with a loud voice, he said, "Father, unto thy hands I commend my spirit:" and having said thus, he gave up the ghost."
John19:30: "When Jesus therefore had received the vinegar, he said, "It is finished:" and he bowed his head, and gave up the ghost."
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Years of famine
II SAMUEL 24:13: So God came to David, and told him, and said unto him, shall SEVEN YEARS OF FAMINE come unto thee in thy land? or will thou flee three months before thine enemies, while they pursue. thee?
I CHRONICLES 21:11: SO God came to David, and said unto him, Thus saith the LORD, Choose thee. Either THREE YEARS OF FAMINE or three months to be destryed before thy foes, while that the sword of thine enemies overtaketh thee;
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Moved David to anger?
II SAMUEL 24: And again the anger of the LORD was kindled against Israel, and he moved David against them to say, Go, number Isreal and Judah.
I CHRONICLES 21: And SATAN stood up against Isreal, and provoked David to number Israel.
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The GENEALOGY OF JESUS?
In two places in the New Testament the genealogy of Jesus son of Mary is mentioned. Matthew 1:6-16 and Luke 3:23-31. Each gives the ancestors of Joseph the CLAIMED husband of Mary and Step father of Jesus. The first one starts from Abraham(verse 2) all the way down to Jesus. The second one from Jesus all the way back to Adam. The only common name to these two lists between David and Jesus is JOSEPH, How can this be true? and also How can Jesus have a genealogy when all Muslims and most Christians believe that Jesus had/has no father.
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God be seen?
Exod. 24:9,10; Amos 9:1; Gen. 26:2; and John 14:9
God CAN be seen:
"And I will take away my hand, and thou shalt see my backparts." (Ex. 33:23)
"And the Lord spake to Moses face to face, as a man speaketh to his friend." (Ex. 33:11)
"For I have seen God face to face, and my life is preserved." (Gen. 32:30)
God CANNOT be seen:
"No man hath seen God at any time." (John 1:18)
"And he said, Thou canst not see my face; for there shall no man see me and live." (Ex. 33:20)
"Whom no man hath seen nor can see." (1 Tim. 6:16)
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CRUEL, UNMERCIFUL, DESTRUCTIVE, and FEROCIOUS or KIND, MERCIFUL, and GOOD:
"I will not pity, nor spare, nor have mercy, but destroy." (Jer. 13:14) "Now go and smite Amalek, and utterly destroy all that they have, and spare them not, but slay both man and woman, infant and suckling."
"The Lord is very pitiful and of tender mercy." (James 5:11)
"For his mercy endureth forever." (1 Chron. 16:34)
"The Lord is good to all, and his tender mercies are over all his works." (Ps. 145:9)
"God is love." (1 John 4:16)
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Tempts?
"And it came to pass after these things, that God did tempt Abraham." (Gen 22:1)
"Let no man say when he is tempted, I am tempted of God; for God cannot be tempted with evil, neither tempteth he any man." (James 1:13)
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Judas died how?
"And he cast down the pieces of silver into the temple and departed, and went out and hanged himself." (Matt. 27:5)
"And falling headlong, he burst asunder in the midst, and all of his bowels gushed out." (Acts 1:18)
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Ascend to heaven
"And Elijah went up by a whirlwind into heaven." (2 Kings 2:11)
"No man hath ascended up to heaven but he that came down from heaven, ... the Son of Man." (John 3:13)
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What was Jesus' prediction regarding Peter's denial?
Before the cock crow - Matthew 26:34
Before the cock crow twice - Mark 14:30
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How many times did the cock crow?
MAR 14:72 And the second time the cock crew. And Peter called to mind the word that Jesus said unto him, Before the cock crow twice, thou shalt deny me thrice. And when he thought thereon, he wept.
MAT 26:74 Then began he to curse and to swear, saying, I know not the man. And immediately the cock crew.
MAT 26:75 And Peter remembered the word of Jesus, which said unto him, Before the cock crow, thou shalt deny me thrice. And he went out, and wept bitterly.
LUK 22:60 And Peter said, Man, I know not what thou sayest. And immediately, while he yet spake, the cock crew.
LUK 22:61 And the Lord turned, and looked upon Peter. And Peter remembered the word of the Lord, how he had said unto him, Before the cock crow, thou shalt deny me thrice.
JOH 13:38 Jesus answered him, Wilt thou lay down thy life for my sake? Verily, verily, I say unto thee, The cock shall not crow, still thou hast denied me thrice.
JOH 18:27 Peter then denied again: and immediately the cock crew.
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Who killed Saul
SA1 31:4 Then said Saul unto his armourbearer, Draw thy sword, and thrust me through therewith; lest these uncircumcised come and thrust me through, and abuse me. But his armourbearer would not; for he was sore afraid. Therefore Saul took a sword, and fell upon it.
SA1 31:5 And when his armourbearer saw that Saul was dead, he fell likewise upon his sword, and died with him.
SA1 31:6 So Saul died, and his three sons, and his armourbearer, and all his men, that same day together.
SA2 1:15 And David called one of the young men, and said, Go near, and fall upon him. And he smote him that he died.
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How many beatitudes in the Sermon on the Mount
MAT 5:3 Blessed are the poor in spirit: for theirs is the kingdom of heaven.
MAT 5:4 Blessed are they that mourn: for they shall be comforted.
MAT 5:5 Blessed are the meek: for they shall inherit the earth.
MAT 5:6 Blessed are they which do hunger and thirst after righteousness: for they shall be filled.
MAT 5:7 Blessed are the merciful: for they shall obtain mercy.
MAT 5:8 Blessed are the pure in heart: for they shall see God.
MAT 5:9 Blessed are the peacemakers: for they shall be called the children of God.
MAT 5:10 Blessed are they which are persecuted for righteousness' sake: for theirs is the kingdom of heaven.
MAT 5:11 Blessed are ye, when men shall revile you, and persecute you, and shall say all manner of evil against you falsely, for my sake.
LUK 6:20 And he lifted up his eyes on his disciples, and said, Blessed be ye poor: for yours is the kingdom of God.
LUK 6:21 Blessed are ye that hunger now: for ye shall be filled. Blessed are ye that weep now: for ye shall laugh.
LUK 6:22 Blessed are ye, when men shall hate you, and when they shall separate you from their company, and shall reproach you, and cast out your name as evil, for the Son of man's sake.
LUK 6:23 Rejoice ye in that day, and leap for joy: for, behold, your reward is great in heaven: for in the like manner did their fathers unto the prophets.
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Does every man sin?
KI1 8:46 If they sin against thee, (for there is no man that sinneth not,) and thou be angry with them, and deliver them to the enemy, so that they carry them away captives unto the land of the enemy, far or near;
CH2 6:36 If they sin against thee, (for there is no man which sinneth not,) and thou be angry with them, and deliver them over before their enemies, and they carry them away captives unto a land far off or near;
PRO 20:9 Who can say, I have made my heart clean, I am pure from my sin?
ECC 7:20 For there is not a just man upon earth, that doeth good, and sinneth not.
JO1 1:8 If we say that we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us.
JO1 1:9 If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just to forgive us our sins, and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness.
JO1 1:10 If we say that we have not sinned, we make him a liar, and his word is not in us.
JO1 3:9 Whosoever is born of God doth not commit sin; for his seed remaineth in him: and he cannot sin, because he is born of God.
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Who bought potter's field
ACT 1:18 Now this man purchased a field with the reward of iniquity; and falling headlong, he burst asunder in the midst, and all his bowels gushed out.
ACT 1:19 And it was known unto all the dwellers at Jerusalem; insomuch as that field is called in their proper tongue, Aceldama, that is to say, The field of blood.
MAT 27:6 And the chief priests took the silver pieces, and said, It is not lawful for to put them into the treasury, because it is the price of blood.
MAT 27:7 And they took counsel, and bought with them the potter's field, to bury strangers in.
MAT 27:8 Wherefore that field was called, The field of blood, unto this day.
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Who prophesied the potter's field?
Matthew 27:9-10 (mentions Jeremy but no such verse in Jeremiah) is in Zechariah 11:12-13
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Who bears guilt?
GAL 6:2 Bear ye one another's burdens, and so fulfil the law of Christ.
GAL 6:5 For every man shall bear his own burden.
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Do you answer a fool?
PRO 26:4 Answer not a fool according to his folly, lest thou also be like unto him.
PRO 26:5 Answer a fool according to his folly, lest he be wise in his own conceit.
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How many children did Michal, the daughter of Saul, have?
SA2 6:23 Therefore Michal the daughter of Saul had no child unto the day of her death.
SA2 21:8 But the king took the two sons of Rizpah the daughter of Aiah, whom she bare unto Saul, Armoni and Mephibosheth; and the five sons of Michal the daughter of Saul, whom she brought up for Adriel the son of Barzillai the Meholathite:
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How old was Jehoiachin when he began to reign?
KI2 24:8 Jehoiachin was eighteen years old when he began to reign, and he reigned in Jerusalem three months. And his mother's name was Nehushta, the daughter of Elnathan of Jerusalem.
CH2 36:9 Jehoiachin was eight years old when he began to reign, and he reigned three months and ten days in Jerusalem: and he did that which was evil in the sight of the LORD.
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Marriage?
Proverbs 18:22
1 Corinthians 7 (whole book. See 1,2,27,39,40)
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Did those with Saul/Paul at his conversion hear a voice?
ACT 9:7 And the men which journeyed with him stood speechless, hearing a voice, but seeing no man.
ACT 22:9 And they that were with me saw indeed the light, and were afraid; but they heard not the voice of him that spake to me.
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Where was Jesus three days after his baptism?
MAR 1:12 And immediately the spirit driveth him into the wilderness.
JOH 1:35 Again the next day after John stood, and two of his disciples;
(various trapsing)
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How many apostles were in office between the resurection and ascention?
1 Corinthians 15:5 (12)
Matthew 27:3-5 (minus one from 12)
Acts 1:9-26 (Mathias not elected until after resurrection)
MAT 28:16 Then the eleven disciples went away into Galilee, into a mountain where Jesus had appointed them.
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Judging
1 Cor 2:15 "The spiritual man makes judgments about all things, but he himself is not subject to any man's judgment:" (NIV)
1 Cor 4:5 "Therefore judge nothing before the appointed time; wait till the Lord comes. He will bring to light what is hidden in darkness and will expose the motives of men's hearts. At that time each will receive his praise from God."
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Good deeds
Matt 5:16 "In the same way, let your light shine before men, that they may see your good deeds and praise your Father in heaven." (NIV)
Matt 6:3-4 "But when you give to the needy, do not let your left hand know what your right hand is doing, so that your giving may be in secert. Then your Father, who sees what is done in secret, will reward you." (NIV)
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For or against?
MAT 12:30 He that is not with me is against me; and he that gathereth not with me scattereth abroad.
(default is against)
MAR 9:40 For he that is not against us is on our part.
(default is for)
LUK 9:50 And Jesus said unto him, Forbid him not: for he that is not against us is for us.
(default is for)
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Whom did they see at the tomb?
MAT 28:2 And, behold, there was a great earthquake: for the angel of the Lord descended from heaven, and came and rolled back the stone from the door, and sat upon it.
MAT 28:3 His countenance was like lightning, and his raiment white as snow:
MAT 28:4 And for fear of him the keepers did shake, and became as dead men.
MAT 28:5 And the angel answered and said unto the women, Fear not ye: for I know that ye seek Jesus, which was crucified.
MAR 16:5 And entering into the sepulchre, they saw a young man sitting on the right side, clothed in a long white garment; and they were affrighted.
LUK 24:4 And it came to pass, as they were much perplexed thereabout, behold, two men stood by them in shining garments:
JOH 20:12 And seeth two angels in white sitting, the one at the head, and the other at the feet, where the body of Jesus had lain.
God change?
malachi 3:6
james 1:17
1 samuel 15:29
jonah 3:10
genesis 6:6
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Destruction of cities (what said was jeremiah was zechariah)
MAT 27:9 Then was fulfilled that which was spoken by Jeremy the prophet, saying, And they took the thirty pieces of silver, the price of him that was valued, whom they of the children of Israel did value;
zechariah 11:11-13
(nothing in Jeremiah remotely like)
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Who's sepulchers
acts 7:16
genesis 23:17,18
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Strong drink?
proverbs 31:6,7
john 2:11-11
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When second coming?
MAT 24:34 Verily I say unto you, This generation shall not pass, till all these things be fulfilled.
MAR 13:30 Verily I say unto you, that this generation shall not pass, till all these things be done.
LUK 21:32 Verily I say unto you, This generation shall not pass away, till all be fulfilled.
1 thessalonians 4:15-18
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Solomon's overseers
550 in I Kings 9:23
250 in II Chron 8:10
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The mother of Abijah:
Maachah the daughter of Absalom 2 Chron 9:20
Michaiah the daughter of Uriel 2 Chron 13:2
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When did Baasha die?
26th year of the reign of Asa I Kings 16:6-8
36th year of the reign of Asa I 2 Chron 16:1
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How old was Ahaziah when he began to reign?
22 in 2 Kings 8:26
42 in 2 Chron 22:2
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Who was Josiah's successor?
Jehoahaz - 2 Chron 36:1
Shallum - Jeremiah 22:11
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The differences in the census figures of Ezra and Nehemiah.
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What was the color of the robe placed on Jesus during his trial?
scarlet - Matthew 27:28
purple John 19:2
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What did they give him to drink?
vinegar - Matthew 27:34
wine with myrrh - Mark 15:23
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How long was Jesus in the tomb?
Depends where you look; Matthew 12:40 gives Jesus prophesying that he will spend "three days and three nights in the heart of the earth," and Mark 10:34 has "after three days (meta treis emeras) he will rise again." As far as I can see from a quick look, the prophecies have "after three days," but the post-Resurrection narratives have "on the third day."
Dave, I'm questioning your motive in doing this. Since you're posting this laundry list of contradictions on an atheist forum for atheists, what you're doing is preaching to the choir. The only reason they'd ever use this list is to post on some other theist forum...Which brings me back to my main point.
What exactly is the point of posting a list of contradictions?
1) If a contradiction is in the Bible, the Bible isn't God's word.
Well, this may be true. But even if it isn't God's word, then it still must be examined like any other historical document. This is not hard to grasp. If the historican Tacitus contradicted Josephus, you would still treat the Annals and the Antiquities as historical accounts that must be critically examined. What makes the Bible any different? It contains truth claims that must be established as true or false.
2) If a contradiction is in the Bible, the whole thing is false.
But this statement is absurd, and you know it. There have been many archeological discoveries backing things in the Gospel stories, so we know for a fact that at least [i]some[/i] of it's descriptions are true. Saying, "The Bible is false" means nothing if you're talking about the whole book in one statement.
So what, exactly, is your aim in doing such a thing?
I may or may not go through this list and respond to each one. After a cursory glance of your list, I have seen nothing that I haven't dealt with before. Many of them I've dealt with multiple times. Some of them I've debated Rook on...He still hasn't responded to my post that I made several months ago, I might add.
~P-Dunn
PS. I'm not a fundamentalist.
If I ever find time to respond I'll respond to each of those. In meantime I suggest you have a look around here:
http://www.tektonics.org/
You can find most of those somewhere on taht site.
I'll make a deal with you Dave, pick a 'contradiction' you want to cover and I'll prove it wrong here or on theologyweb.com.
Ok I'm bored, so I thought I'd pick out a few of my favorites and show just how silly these are.
[quote=Dave_G]The bat is not a bird
LEV 11:13 And these are they which ye shall have in abomination among the fowls; they shall not be eaten, they are an abomination: the eagle, and the ossifrage, and the ospray,
LEV 11:14 And the vulture, and the kite after his kind;
LEV 11:15 Every raven after his kind;
LEV 11:16 And the owl, and the night hawk, and the cuckow, and the hawk after his kind,
LEV 11:17 And the little owl, and the cormorant, and the great owl,
LEV 11:18 And the swan, and the pelican, and the gier eagle,
LEV 11:19 And the stork, the heron after her kind, and the lapwing, and the bat.
DEU 14:11 Of all clean birds ye shall eat.
DEU 14:12 But these are they of which ye shall not eat: the eagle, and the ossifrage, and the ospray,
DEU 14:13 And the glede, and the kite, and the vulture after his kind,
DEU 14:14 And every raven after his kind,
DEU 14:15 And the owl, and the night hawk, and the cuckow, and the hawk after his kind,
DEU 14:16 The little owl, and the great owl, and the swan,
DEU 14:17 And the pelican, and the gier eagle, and the cormorant,
DEU 14:18 And the stork, and the heron after her kind, and the lapwing, and the bat.[/quote]
The hebrew word here translated as 'bird' actually means 'winged creature.' The ancient Isrealites didnt use the same system of taxanomy we use now.
[quote]When second coming?
MAT 24:34 Verily I say unto you, This generation shall not pass, till all these things be fulfilled.
MAR 13:30 Verily I say unto you, that this generation shall not pass, till all these things be done.
LUK 21:32 Verily I say unto you, This generation shall not pass away, till all be fulfilled.
1 thessalonians 4:15-18[/quote]
I dont see a 'contradiction' here. Unless your trying to make a point that it didnt happen. In which case I would suggest you look into preterism heres a couple of good sites to help you out:
http://www.preteristsite.com/
http://www.tektonics.org/esch/eschatology.html
[quote]Do you answer a fool?
PRO 26:4 Answer not a fool according to his folly, lest thou also be like unto him.
PRO 26:5 Answer a fool according to his folly, lest he be wise in his own conceit.[/quote]
The passage here is describing a dilema. a Catch-22 if you will. Its not giving out absolute moral advice.
[quote]The GENEALOGY OF JESUS?
In two places in the New Testament the genealogy of Jesus son of Mary is mentioned. Matthew 1:6-16 and Luke 3:23-31. Each gives the ancestors of Joseph the CLAIMED husband of Mary and Step father of Jesus. The first one starts from Abraham(verse 2) all the way down to Jesus. The second one from Jesus all the way back to Adam. The only common name to these two lists between David and Jesus is JOSEPH, How can this be true? [/quote]
Matthew's genelogy is his legal line(ie who inhereted rights from whom) while Lukes is his biological line. Matthew's ends at Abraham because it was to him that God first promised the Land of Isreal(iow the legal line ends with Abraham) whereas Lukes goes on to list his biological decendants.
[quote]and also How can Jesus have a genealogy when all Muslims and most Christians believe that Jesus had/has no father.[/quote]
If I'm not mistaken its not so much about his genes, as it is his legal status as a rightfull heir to the Kingship if Isreal.
[quote]The shape of the earth
ISA 40:22 It is he that sitteth upon the circle of the earth, and the inhabitants thereof are as grasshoppers; that stretcheth out the heavens as a curtain, and spreadeth them out as a tent to dwell in:[/quote]
You know the word here translated as circle can also mean 'sphere' In fact my Bible translates it as such.
[quote]MAT 4:8 Again, the devil taketh him up into an exceeding high mountain, and sheweth him all the kingdoms of the world, and the glory of them;
Astromical bodies are spherical, and you cannot see the entire exterior surface from anyplace. The kingdoms of Egypt, China, Greece, Crete, sections of Asia Minor, India, Maya (in Mexico), Carthage (North Africa), Rome (Italy), Korea, and other settlements from these kingdoms of the world were widely distributed.[/quote]
Which is why I would think it should be obvious that what Matthew is describing is a supernatural vision. Oh and he probably wasnt thinking of the whole world, but the Roman empire and maybe a couple of its neighbors.
[quote]The hydrological cycle
ECC 1:7 All the rivers run into the sea; yet the sea is not full; unto the place from whence the rivers come, thither they return again.
JOB 38:22 Hast thou entered into the treasures of the snow? or hast thou seen the treasures of the hail,
Storehouses are not part of the cycle[/quote]
Right and people never talk in poetical language. Particularly to make a point that there are mysteries that only God fully understands.
[quote]Earth supported?
JOB 26:7 He stretcheth out the north over the empty place, and hangeth the earth upon nothing.
JOB 38:4 Where wast thou when I laid the foundations of the earth? declare, if thou hast understanding.
Heaven supported too
JOB 26:11 The pillars of heaven tremble and are astonished at his reproof.[/quote]
Again obviously poetical language, in this case showing God's role in sustaining and protecting the earth.
[quote]Odd genetic engineering
GEN 30:39 And the flocks conceived before the rods, and brought forth cattle ringstraked, speckled, and spotted.[/quote]
Its called 'sympathitic magic.' It was actually common in hte ancient world. However its a moot point anyway because Genesis 31:10-13 explains that it was Gods divine intervention and not the sticks that caused the appearnces of the cows.
Alright maybe if I get bored again I'll deal with some more. But that should be enough for now.
Did you know Jesus's geonology has been dis proven?
Unless there is a gap between Adam and G-d.
[quote=Dave_G]Did you know Jesus's geonology has been dis proven?
Unless there is a gap between Adam and G-d.[/quote]
You know I have absolutely no idea what you are talking about?
[quote=Sir-Think-A-Lot][quote=Dave_G]Did you know Jesus's geonology has been dis proven?
Unless there is a gap between Adam and G-d.[/quote]
You know I have absolutely no idea what you are talking about? [/quote]
The one that traces his genealogy back to Adam, there have been WAY more human generations that 63.
Dave....shhh!
[quote=American Atheist]Dave....shhh![/quote]
OK. If we can't debate what are we supposed to do on this site?
[quote=Dave_G]Did you know Jesus's geonology has been dis proven?
Unless there is a gap between Adam and G-d.[/quote]
Here's something to read:
http://www.christian-thinktank.com/fabprof4.html
Now I want to see you prove Glenn Miller wrong.
[quote=Dave_G]OK. If we can't debate what are we supposed to do on this site?[/quote]
:sigh: You do know he was most likely being a sarcastic. Are you as dense as a brick wall?
[quote=Dave_G]
How many stalls and horsemen?
KI1 4:26 And Solomon had forty thousand stalls of horses for his chariots, and twelve thousand horsemen.
CH2 9:25 And Solomon had four thousand stalls for horses and chariots, and twelve thousand horsemen; whom he bestowed in the chariot cities, and with the king at Jerusalem.
[/quote]
um, first of all, who really cares how many horses he had? besides if some scribe guy was making a new copy of the bible by writing it as someone read it to him, it'd be pretty easy to accidentally write four instead of forty or forty instead of four because they sound really similar. haha, go pick on the typos in some other book, i bet it was really hard to copy books by hand! ;)
[quote=Dave_G]
Is it folly to be wise or not?
PRO 4:7 Wisdom is the principal thing; therefore get wisdom: and with all thy getting get understanding.
ECC 1:18 For in much wisdom is much grief: and he that increaseth knowledge increaseth sorrow.
1 Cor.1:19: "For it is written, I will destroy the wisdom of the wise, and wil bring to nothing the understanding of the prudent."
[/quote]
'k, well that actually isn't much a contradiction. it never says wisdom is folly at all, and it never says you shouldn't work to be wise, so technically you can't call it a contradiction, but whatever. this one is just kinda how life is. heck, the more i understand what's going on in the world the more grief i have! i mean, seriously, there are so many bad things happening, and if i had more knowledge of them it WOULD increase my sorrow, but it would also (like it says in the first verse) help me understand and maybe be able to act on my understanding and wisdom. the third verse is taken out of context, because if you read the verse before it says "For the message of the cross is foolishness to those who are perishing, but to us who are being saved it is the power of God." (1 Corinthians 1:18) so it's actually talking about wise people saying that belief in God is foolish because they don't actually understand what's going on. so yeah, that one just actually just be removed from the list of contradictions i guess.
[quote=Dave_G]
Snails do not melt
PSA 58:8 As a snail which melteth, let every one of them pass away: like the untimely birth of a woman, that they may not see the sun.
[/quote]
well, they do if you put salt on them kinda...hahahaha, and the psalms were written poetically, so maybe it made sense to the poet. that one just makes me laugh actually....plus, if people used to think that rotten meat actually turned into maggots and other misconceptions of old like that, they probably had some weird reason for thinking that snails (it actually says slugs in my bible, but whatev) melted away. it could be kinda like poetic license.
[quote=Dave_G]
Snakes, while built low, do not eat dirt
GEN 3:14 And the LORD God said unto the serpent, Because thou hast done this, thou art cursed above all cattle, and above every beast of the field; upon thy belly shalt thou go, and dust shalt thou eat all the days of thy life:
[/quote]
'k, well, yeah, snakes don't eat dust, that's a fact. but i think you're taking it a bit too literally. it's probably just like "HA, here's another crappy thing you have to contend with, snake, you have to crawl around on the dusty, icky ground now." it's a bit like shoving someone's face in the dirt and being like "eat dust, sucker," i suppose. again, poetic license...
[quote=Dave_G]
JOB 26:7 He stretcheth out the north over the empty place, and hangeth the earth upon nothing.
JOB 38:4 Where wast thou when I laid the foundations of the earth? declare, if thou hast understanding.
Heaven supported too
JOB 26:11 The pillars of heaven tremble and are astonished at his reproof.
[/quote]
poetic license....blah....this is all just Job saying poetically how awesome God is, and then Job 38:4 is God telling Job that He's waaaaay older and wiser than Job so Job shouldn't be questioning what He does.
[quote=Dave_G]
The hydrological cycle
ECC 1:7 All the rivers run into the sea; yet the sea is not full; unto the place from whence the rivers come, thither they return again.
JOB 38:22 Hast thou entered into the treasures of the snow? or hast thou seen the treasures of the hail,
Storehouses are not part of the cycle
[/quote]
you're right, storehouses are NOT part of the cycle, but did you notice? the second verse is from JOB again...so Job is story about what happened to Job and it's pretty much all told poetically, so unless you like to analyze poetry, i wouldn't recommend literally translating all of Job. and you failed to mention the fact that it's actually pretty freakin' amazing that somebody waaaaay back when actually knew about the hydrological cycle, because that was formally discovered at some time waaaay after the bible was written because people used to believe that water returned to the mountains from the oceans through underground channels driven by the wind, as weird as it sounds.
[quote=Dave_G]
Righteous live?
Ps.92:12: "The righteous shall flourish like the palm tree."
Isa.57:1: "The righteous perisheth, and no man layeth it to heart."
[/quote]
dude, you didn't even quote the whole verse of Isaiah 57:1, and it's taken way out of context! what it really says is "The righteous perish, and no one ponders it in his heart; devout men are taken away, and no one understands that the righteous are taken away to be spared from evil." and Isaiah 57:2 says "Those who walk uprightly enter into peace; they find rest as they lie in death" so when you look at the Isaiah verse IN CONTEXT it makes way more sense, and the verse in psalm 92:12 just says that the righteous will flourish; it doesn't say that they will live a long time, it just says they will flourish. and to christians, going to heaven is pretty flourish-y, so there is no contradiction there.
man, alright, i'm supposed to be writing a paper for my english class right now, but this was more interesting, but i really do have to finish my paper, so that's all i had time for at the moment. i just kinda picked ones that i could answer more briefly, but it turned out to be pretty long...oh well...haha
oh yeah, and you probably could have answered most of these contradictions yourself, so i'm kinda wondering why you posted them even if you could have realized they weren't contradictions in the first place.
[quote=lilangelofterror][quote=Dave_G]OK. If we can't debate what are we supposed to do on this site?[/quote]
:sigh: You do know he was most likely being a sarcastic. Are you as dense as a brick wall?
[/quote]
I hope you know you're a false convert and that I was joking you worthless pile of shit.
[quote=lilangelofterror][quote=Dave_G]Did you know Jesus's geonology has been dis proven?
Unless there is a gap between Adam and G-d.[/quote]
Here's something to read:
http://www.christian-thinktank.com/fabprof4.html
Now I want to see you prove Glenn Miller wrong.[/quote]
LOL nope because thats a christian site not a history site.
[quote=Dave_G]I hope you know you're a false convert and that I was joking you worthless pile of ****.[/quote]
Translation: "I can't answer you, so I'm just going to call names." Now now Davey, you must write 100x's on a piece of paper (and this is due tomorrow).
"I will not pretend to be informed on biblical issues."
Keep showing us all that 'rational thought' you keep saying you have. *rofl*
Crystal
[quote=Dave_G]
LOL nope because thats a christian site not a history site.[/quote]
Wow... nice poisoning the well there. The Irrational Responders have taught you well! Now little one, do you care to prove Glenn Miller wrong or will you show us all that you're an idiot who uncritically accepts whatever he hears?
Crystal
Dave_G
[quote]I hope you know you're a false convert and that I was joking you worthless pile of shit.[/quote]
Way to take the High Moral Ground! :)
I am not too offended by bad language, but it ruins your arguments when you start flinging insults (Richard dawkins, as smart as he is, would lose any debate if he decided to moon his opponent instead of cite sources)
[quote=Dave_G]
I hope you know you're a false convert and that I was joking you worthless pile of shit.[/quote]
I find it funny that an athiest thinks he's qualified to judge who is(and isnt) a 'true Christian.'
yeah, True Christian is a dumb thing to say... I mean the only ones that would not be true Christians could be Muslims (they believe in christ... but not the bible totally...) and satinists (believe in jesus, but support other side... or whatever... First Church of Satan is different... never mind)
I mean if you classify 'true christian' as one who literally followes everything christ said... then only a handful of people would qualify (apostles and paul come to mind...)
i really like your signature quote, Guruite. guru is bahasa indonesia (indonesian) for teacher, btw.
[quote]LOL nope because thats a christian site not a history site.[/quote]
Okay, then. Next time you post a video to a video or an article on the Christ-myth, I'll simply say, "LOL nope because thats an atheist site night a history site."
Fair enough?
[quote=P-Dunn]
Fair enough?[/quote]
Awww... did you have to go and prove him wrong again? Poor baby... he can't get anything right.
hey, be nicer to the kid; at least he's willing to talk about it. (even if he is kinda mean sometimes) lots of people i try to debate with will just say their one Jesus-bash and then be like "no, i don't want to talk about it." so yeah, thanks for actually talking about Jesus and God, Dave_G, even if it IS in a negative way.
[quote=P-Dunn][quote]LOL nope because thats a christian site not a history site.[/quote]
Okay, then. Next time you post a video to a video or an article on the Christ-myth, I'll simply say, "LOL nope because thats an atheist site night a history site."
Fair enough?[/quote]
Yeah by a historian who has done his research outside the atheist doctrine.
[quote=lilangelofterror][quote=P-Dunn]
Fair enough?[/quote]
Awww... did you have to go and prove him wrong again? Poor baby... he can't get anything right.
[/quote]
LOL quit pretending to be an expert you relise you hav'nt given any arguements outside the Bible?
[quote=Dave_G]
LOL quit pretending to be an expert you relise you hav'nt given any arguements outside the Bible?[/quote]
You really love to say silly things huh? Why do I expect to see an argument outside the Bible to prove that the Bible isn't contradictory on Jesus' genealogy? Historians say the Bible is historical, when you finally understand that (which as far as I can tell, you are too busy reading 19th century free thinker garbage to do that) you can come back and try this again. For now, do you have anything against my reference or just the same cards fundy atheist often pull when they have a lack of answers?
[quote=lilangelofterror][quote=Dave_G]
LOL quit pretending to be an expert you relise you hav'nt given any arguements outside the Bible?[/quote]
You really love to say silly things huh? Why do I expect to see an argument outside the Bible to prove that the Bible isn't contradictory on Jesus' genealogy? Historians say the Bible is historical, when you finally understand that (which as far as I can tell, you are too busy reading 19th century free thinker garbage to do that) you can come back and try this again. For now, do you have anything against my reference or just the same cards fundy atheist often pull when they have a lack of answers?
[/quote]
Why don't you act like a Christian? I think you don't want people to join your cult, and why come to a teens site? your avoiding the question.
And quit taking your anger out on me and go see a thearapists. Don't bother replying because I'm through talking to you, enjoy livng by mytholagy. But I chose reality, bye.
Don't reply to this since you won't get a response back sinse you already lost..
[quote=Dave_G]Why don't you act like a Christian?[/quote]
So calling you out and proving you wrong isn't acting like a Christian in your little world? Do you accept everything you want to hear without question? Yes you do, so pointing this out is an issue why? You know what I do when proven wrong? Get a better argument or do some more research, might want to do that yourself. All you have below is a self esteem salvage... *hehe*
[quote]I think you don't want people to join your cult, and why come to a teens site? your avoiding the question.[/quote]
You really have issues paying attention, don't you? I come here for my entertainment. It's fun to watch you jump around like a fish out of water scrambling for answers you don't have. I hang out with adults far older then me on Theologyweb all the time, going to join us now or are you just as chicken as you accuse me of?
[quote]And quit taking your anger out on me and go see a thearapists. Don't bother replying because I'm through talking to you, enjoy livng by mytholagy. But I chose reality, bye.[/quote]
Anger? *rofl* Sorry buddy... but I'm not angry at all, I'm just answering you in a logical way and watching you jump though more hoops then a dolphin at sea world to avoid seeing the error of your ways. So calling you somebody who uncritically accepts whatever he wants to hear without question (which keeps being proven true) is an issue why? Now, prove me wrong or bring your friends from RRS over here or to T-web.
[quote]Don't reply to this since you won't get a response back sinse you already lost..[/quote]
And he tries to salvage his self esteem... anyone want to bet he'll respond back? Anyone going to guess when he'll take my challange on T-web?
LOL!!! I figured out why you not coming to rrs.. It's because your not allowed there!!!! LOL!!!!!!!! I guess they got tired of all your worthless insults. So you going to deny the fact that your not welcome there?
And the reason Rook won't come their is because hes busy writing his book and hes debating Ergun Caner in September,
LOL I can't wait till they finally kick you off here.
[quote=Dave_g]LOL!!! I figured out why you not coming to rrs.. It's because your not allowed there!!!! LOL!!!!!!!! I guess they got tired of all your worthless insults. So you going to deny the fact that your not welcome there?[/quote]
Doesn't surprise me if I was banned, they do ban people who can prove them wrong (they have banned people from theoloyweb, funny how atheist accuse Christians of being that way). If they did ban me, that's not something to be ashamed of, it's an honor! BTW, if my user name works here, it most likely works there too... both web sites do use the same user name. Now if you're RRS crew wants to debate me, they are welcome here or on theologyweb.... now will you take my challenge and join me on t-web or will you end up like the rest of the RRS and chicken out?
[quote]And the reason Rook won't come their is because hes busy writing his book and hes debating Ergun Caner in September,[/quote]
You do know... I do have a full time job, volunteer duties and getting ready to start school part time. Yet I still have time to debate and prove you wrong again and again.
[quote]LOL I can't wait till they finally kick you off here.[/quote]
In other words, you can't wait till you're allowed to rant and nobody is here to prove you wrong. It's rather simple Davey... unless they ban me... I'm going to come here and make a fool of you and prove before everyone that you have not a clue what you are talking about. I see you (just like the rest of the RRS crew) refuse to debate us on theologyweb, does this mean you're too chicken?
Crystal
BTW, if I were to be banned from here... it's nothing to be ashamed of... it's a badge of honor.
Good news Rook said he will debate you in real life if you are willing.
Yet I still have time to debate and prove you wrong again and again.
__________________________________________________
Prove God then I will share your proof with all my atheist friends.
___________________________________________________
nobody is here to prove you wrong
___________________________________________________
Prove this statement wrong:
There is no God.
___________________________________________________
I'm going to come here and make a fool of you and prove before everyone that you have not a clue what you are talking about.
________________________________________________-_---
Nah I don't feel like debating some guy who wrote a blog on theolagy web. I'm sticking with my claim that you can't prove wrong:
There is no God. So what makes you want to stay on a site for teen atheists?
And show me your collage schollership, not that a Bible schollership is a badge of honer no more than a koran schollership is a badge of honer. Well laugh it up because once the FSM comes you won't be a christian anymore.:P
[quote=Dave_G]Good news Rook said he will debate you in real life if you are willing.[/quote]
Sorry, I only do text debates. Video and audio debates are classics for soundbites, sorry... no soundbites for me. It will be in text here or on T-web or no deal.
[quote=lilangelofterror][quote=Dave_G]Good news Rook said he will debate you in real life if you are willing.[/quote]
Sorry, I only do text debates. Video and audio debates are classics for soundbites, sorry... no soundbites for me. It will be in text here or on T-web or no deal.[/quote]
Cowerd.
I acctuly made an account but they never sent the activation code so any site that slow is not worth my time.
I'm a coward, yet I challenge him to a written debate? Hummm... interesting... You know why I don't do live debates? Because it gets off topic and ends up like 99% of the RRS nonsense where they resort to soundbites and out of context quotes. If Rook and company want to do a debate, it will be in text only on here on T-web. Either one they want. Sorry, I don't play that game.
[quote=Dave_G]I acctuly made an account but they never sent the activation code so any site that slow is not worth my time.[/quote]
What's your user name? I will contact LS and get you that activation code by the end of the day.
[quote]Good news Rook said he will debate you in real life if you are willing.[/quote]
Debating Rook "in real life" is probably the biggest waste of a Christian apologist's time I can think of.
I've listened to him debate live several times now. His main tactic is to assert that you either aren't answering his questions or you are missing his points. He also uses overbroad language to make it nearly impossible to prove him wrong in a limited environment; this is called arguing by soundbite.
On the other hand, debating him using text is much more valuable. You can easily expose his hypocrisy and his double standards, and you can nail him on his research.